ES_97Sport
Rock Warrior
Reged: 07/19/03
Posts: 548
Loc: Colorado, US
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After passing the 530K on my black '97 SAS'd Sport I found out today that #3 is down to 80psi. Sigh. Engine rebuild or replacement time.
I've managed to find some information on sticking a 6G74 in older stuff but no answers for more recent vehicles.
I have an opportunity to pick up a complete 2000 SOHC 3.5L with 50K out of a Montero Sport for a reasonable price. No wireing, starter, air conditioner, of course. I won't be doing the swap so I need to know how complex this may be before deciding on going down this path.
My current Sport is a '97 LS 5-speed V5MT1-6.
What I think I know is the engine should bolt in fine without modifications. Trans/bell housing/starter are direct bolt-ups. Accessory mounts from the 3.0 bolt to the 3.5 as well as the accessories. I think all the wiring will also plug directly into the 3.5 sensors. ECU?
Feedback? What am I missing?
Edward
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'97 Montero Sport LS 5-Speed 3.5L conversion
SAS Dana 44s & ARBs, 35" Yoko Geolandar M/Ts
NP231 B4R doubler/Terra Low231/RP 5.38 228:1
'03 Montero Sport Limited AWD
'97 Montero Sport LS 5-Speed 3-link/SAS project
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fasteddy
Web Wheeler
Reged: 01/30/01
Posts: 12703
Loc: Flat Creek, GA
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The deck height is about 19mm higher for the longer stroke, but all that means is you need 3.5 timing belt, and you'll have to figure out accessory belt lengths. There will be a problem with the exhaust length too, but if you use 3.5 mani's and downpipes, it should work. You will be increasing air flow, and I'd rather use the 3.5 ecu and harness if possible to get a better match in case the 3.0 maf doesn't have enough range.
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"If you can't be a good influence, don't worry, you can still be a horrid example."
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ES_97Sport
Rock Warrior
Reged: 07/19/03
Posts: 548
Loc: Colorado, US
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Quote:
The deck height is about 19mm higher for the longer stroke, but all that means is you need 3.5 timing belt, and you'll have to figure out accessory belt lengths. There will be a problem with the exhaust length too, but if you use 3.5 mani's and downpipes, it should work. You will be increasing air flow, and I'd rather use the 3.5 ecu and harness if possible to get a better match in case the 3.0 maf doesn't have enough range.
Ok. As far as I know, this is a complete engine and they're both Federal - minus the following accessories - alternator, p/s pump, and air compressor. The only things coming off my '97 are the accessories. My '97 has electric fans so no fan, shroud, etc. stuff to deal with.
This is what I found looking through parts lists...
2000-2004 3.0/3.5 exhaust parts. Manifolds, gaskets, pipes, etc.
1997-1999 3.0/3.5 exhaust parts. Manifolds, gaskets, pipes, etc.
2000 3.0/3.5 starter and parts. Only listed for the automatic transmission since there's no 5-speed post 1999 in the US.
1999 3.0/3.5 starter. Same for 3/3.5 but different between manual and automatic transmission vehicles. ??? Solenoid and heat shield are the same on all.
2000 3.0/3.5 air compressor and accessory bracket.
1999 3.0/3.5 air compressor and accessory bracket.
2000 3.0/3.5 power steering, accessory bracket and components.
1999 3.0/3.5 power steering, accessory bracket and components.
2000 3.0/3.5 alternator, stay, tensioner, pulley.
1999 3.0/3.5 alternator, stay, tensioner, pulley.
2000 3.0/3.5 MAF, MAP, all the emission doo-dads.
1997-1999 3.0/3.5 MAF, MAP, all the emission doo-dads.
Now, as far as I can tell, everything (I need to worry about) is interchangeable between the 3.0 and 3.5 for the years 1997-1999. Same for the 3.0/3.5 for the year 2000.
The starter is the same for 3.0L manual trans from 1997-99. So, my existing starter should fit in my m/t bell housing with the new engine.
There's no difference between the 1999 3.5L and the 2000 3.5L, correct? So, there shouldn't be any difference in exhaust. These are both Federal, so.... ???
AFAIKT, that leaves the harness. MAF, MAP, IAC, TPS, ignition coils and power transistor. (did I forget something?) All of which are the same between the 3.0 and 3.5 for 1997-1999 and same for the year 2000. I can't tell if they're the same between 1997-99 and 2000 such that they'll just plug into the existing harness and feed back the correct information for the ECU.
As for the ECU, I THINK the injectors between the 3.0 and 3.5L are different flow rates. I can't imagine they could be THAT much different between the SOHC 3 vs 3.5, but what do I know.:) Rather than try and replace the ECU, I think it'd be easier - and cheaper - to have Jet reprogram the existing ECU for the 3.5L.
Edward
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'97 Montero Sport LS 5-Speed 3.5L conversion
SAS Dana 44s & ARBs, 35" Yoko Geolandar M/Ts
NP231 B4R doubler/Terra Low231/RP 5.38 228:1
'03 Montero Sport Limited AWD
'97 Montero Sport LS 5-Speed 3-link/SAS project
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fasteddy
Web Wheeler
Reged: 01/30/01
Posts: 12703
Loc: Flat Creek, GA
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Megasquirt for the ecu and spark control...
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"If you can't be a good influence, don't worry, you can still be a horrid example."
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ES_97Sport
Rock Warrior
Reged: 07/19/03
Posts: 548
Loc: Colorado, US
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Quote:
Megasquirt for the ecu and spark control...
I was thinking Greddy or Haltech as they have direct plug-in kits. But Megasquirt would be an option. All are overkill I think. I have an email to Jet Chips to confirm reprogramming my stock ECU to run the 3.5L. Last I checked it was about $400 for their standard reprogramming on a Sport ECU. Can't imagine they can't do what I want. I'm trying to stay away from a bunch of esoteric modifications to make this work, though.
Wish I had access to the stock maps. I'm not entirely sure that the difference between 3 and 3.5 is enough that my ECU wouldn't be able to handle the difference without reprogramming.
Edward
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'97 Montero Sport LS 5-Speed 3.5L conversion
SAS Dana 44s & ARBs, 35" Yoko Geolandar M/Ts
NP231 B4R doubler/Terra Low231/RP 5.38 228:1
'03 Montero Sport Limited AWD
'97 Montero Sport LS 5-Speed 3-link/SAS project
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TainterRacing
Mudrunner
Reged: 04/17/08
Posts: 343
Loc: Petoskey, Michiagan
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I did a 3.0 in to a 3.5 place but I used a older 12 valve 3.0 so I am not sure what all if diff on then too. I had to change alot of stuff. So I hope your block is not the same. I think what your doing would not be as hard.
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1997 Montero LS with a motor swap a 1990 V6 12valve ported heads I run stock tire size for Daily use, off road have 33x12.5 working on going trubo.
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ES_97Sport
Rock Warrior
Reged: 07/19/03
Posts: 548
Loc: Colorado, US
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Quote:
I did a 3.0 in to a 3.5 place but I used a older 12 valve 3.0 so I am not sure what all if diff on then too. I had to change alot of stuff. So I hope your block is not the same. I think what your doing would not be as hard.
As I understand things, quite a bit changed around the 3.0L right around '95. The 12v and 24v are definitely different - much like the SOHC and the DOHC. Thankfully, I'm not trying to cross a major design boundary.
I actually own two 3.0L '97 Sports and a 3.5L '03 Sport. Just looking at the engines, wireing and accessories side by side, everything looks the same. But, you know how that goes.:)
Different topic. No love from Jet. They say they can't do anything unless they use the specific ECU. So, they can not remap a 3.0L for a 3.5L engine. 'it would be too difficult' are their words.
Edward
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'97 Montero Sport LS 5-Speed 3.5L conversion
SAS Dana 44s & ARBs, 35" Yoko Geolandar M/Ts
NP231 B4R doubler/Terra Low231/RP 5.38 228:1
'03 Montero Sport Limited AWD
'97 Montero Sport LS 5-Speed 3-link/SAS project
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TOASTY
Trail Leader
Reged: 01/17/02
Posts: 5016
Loc: Gilbert AZ, US.
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I didn't really read the post but it's pretty much a direct swap for you (24v SOHC for 24v SOHC) I recently put a 6G74 from an '04 sport into my '99 Montero. A few little things were different like the throttle body and one solenoid so i swapped them from my original engine. I also had to swap oil pans and oil pickup but you won't have to since all sports and L200's are front sump.
As far as ECU's go i wouldn't worry too much about it, you could slap a 3.5 ECU into your truck and see if it runs the 3.0 but i would just do it. It should adjust for the extra air flow and if you really need to take the truck to an import tuner shop they'll do a reflash usually 100-150 dollars.
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Az Crew, full fledged member!
"Strange things are afoot at the Circle-K." -Ted.
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fasteddy
Web Wheeler
Reged: 01/30/01
Posts: 12703
Loc: Flat Creek, GA
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If the 3.0 ecu doesn't work, check out diyautotune.com for megasquirt kits configured for your ride. They've done a ton of mitsu's, and are nice guys. Almost as obsessive as Ed... 
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"If you can't be a good influence, don't worry, you can still be a horrid example."
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ES_97Sport
Rock Warrior
Reged: 07/19/03
Posts: 548
Loc: Colorado, US
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Thanks Toasty. You guys are life savers. This is a TOTALLY unplanned swap.:( It's currently sitting at the dealership with the top end tore apart. Not much point in putting things back together and throwing away money so engine time. I was hoping to get the new Sport built before having to deal with the engine in my existing crawler. Best laid plans and such.:(
That's good news on the sensor/wireing side.
I'm not too concerned with the existing ECU not being able to handle the 3.5L. I really don't think that's likely. At the very least it should start and run with the 3.0L ECU well enough to trailer it. At that point I just need it home and I can take care of any ECU issues myself then.
Do you remember which solenoid?
Edward
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'97 Montero Sport LS 5-Speed 3.5L conversion
SAS Dana 44s & ARBs, 35" Yoko Geolandar M/Ts
NP231 B4R doubler/Terra Low231/RP 5.38 228:1
'03 Montero Sport Limited AWD
'97 Montero Sport LS 5-Speed 3-link/SAS project
|
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